Bristow's Bench safety

[MidDevon]

I hate to tempt fate here but I was more than a little concerned at the exit from the bench following todays match and also following the Cheltenham match.

Those steps are very steep (which is obviously why the view is so fantastic) but it also makes access for the less mobile members of the yellow army pretty difficult.

Today I left the bench immediately on full time and an elderly couple both with walking sticks needed assitance from 3 or 4 fans to enable them to safely navigate down those stairs. This took them an absolute age and fans behind me where getting quite frustrated. One fan was pushing into me in an attempt to get out of the stand quicker and as I was immediately behind this elderly couple it was only me preventing them, in turn, being pushed over. That would have been quite catastrophic.

For all the right reasons, I would suggest less mobile folk would be best advised to wait for the mad "end of match" rush to prevent accidents at future matches. I am sure the vast majority of yellow army fans who do not leave the stand until the rush is over and indeed the stewards would only be too willing to help safely navigate those who needed assistance to ground level.

I know the club is looking into handrails etc, but as an interim measure could warning messages be tannoyed (once that is up and running) at final kick off just to remind everyone to leave the stand slowly and carefully.

If any director doubts the validity of what I am saying perhaps they should come along and stand at the back of the bench just before final whistle at a future match.

[GazTheGull]

I was surprised they got a health and safety certificate for the steps being that steep and without any handrail (down the middle) or anything to aid the elderly

[ferrarilover]

The stand is precisely as steep as the limits of the regulations allow. Handrails will (WILL) be going in fairly soon (quotes being gathered next week).
Decent idea from the OP, I imagine that the old and infirm will learn soon enough that they need to hang about for a bit once the whistle has gone. Teething problems which I'm sure every new stand (and other large public structures) have.

Matt.

[AndyC]

I don't want to bash the club too hard on this matter, but I made people aware as soon as the original plans went up that they were being remiss in not doing something about handrails on the Bench. My dad (84 and confidence in going down stairs rocked by a fall that led to hip surgery) wanted to go back as an STH this season but wouldn't because of his concerns about the new stand and I took the time to contact the club to make those concerns. And that was as far back as the plans being made public so you can judge how much time they had to react.

Reading the updates since it was opened, I am relieved he didn't spend his money on one despite the entertainment he is missing.

Given the demographics of our fans, I think it is downright stupid that this important matter was completely ignored. There are enough sensible people within the club who should have realised this was going to need dealing with.

[portugull]

I think Mid Devon has made an extremely sensible post on what I believe is a very important issue for the club.

I have sat in the bench for the last 3 games against, Stoke, Cheltenham and Rochdale and watched very carefully the difficulty encountered by elderly fans in particular those who rely on walking sticks to access their seat and to leave at the end of the game.

I know that Andrew Candy has got this matter in hand but I do feel that until the handrails are installed the club should instruct the stewards to give elderly and infirm fans a lot more assistance in getting to their seat. The club employs a considerable number of stewards on match days but I get the feeling that they are not to sure of their role when it comes to helping elderly fans.

I am seriously concerned that there is an accident waiting to happen. With the amount of concrete it only needs a fall and for the persons head to strike the concrete for there to be a fatality. I am not scare mongering but I am genuinely concerned about this issue and I urge the club to prioritise this matter before we have a horrible accident.

The tannoy announcements are still completely inaudible and although I know that this matter is also in hand it does seem to be taking a very long time to sort out.

[ferrarilover]

Thing is Andy, this isn't a consideration in isolation. There is no such thing as a free lunch, particularly if that lunch consists of handrail soup.
Regulations governing capacity, alacrity of exit from the Bench and the consequent financial implications were all counter considerations to the idea that a handrail should be incorporated. The club have now seen that it is possible to have cake and eat it.

Matt.

[Gullscorer]

The safety of elderly and disabled spectators, assuming the club wants their attendance at matches, should have taken priority, rather than being an afterthought to all other considerations.

[portugull]

Totally agree Gullscorer. It is not just the safety of elderly fans it is the safety of ALL fans both young and old.
I understand a significant number of long standing season ticket holders did not renew because of genuine concern about their ability to access the Bench.
We spend a fortune on stewards but to build a wonderful new stand with no handrails just makes no sense.

[ferrarilover]

And it was. The safety (and necessary safety certificate requirement) of all fans being able to exit the stand in a sufficiently timely manner was weighed against the benefits of the installation of a handrail and the 'no handrail' option won out. Further consideration has now been given to the scenario in light of the real world difficulties experienced by some fans and the decision has changed. It'll be fixed in a couple of weeks, just be patient and be bloody grateful that we have the Bench at all.

Matt.

[portugull]

Thank you Matt.Your post confirms that the matter was considered but the wrong decision was made.
The construction of the Bench is the best thing to happen to Plainmoor, as a Stadium, in the history of the club. All fans are delighted with the wonderful new stand but I hope you accept that it is not a question of impatience but fear of a serious accident that drives some of us to take this matter so seriously.

[AustrianAndyGull]

Maybe if some fans were more considerate in choosing to help elderly fans who are seen having difficulties getting down the steps instead of barging past and pushing, shoving and nudging then we might not have as big a problem as it has become now. If you want to get out of the ground in 2 minutes flat because your bus / train or whatever is due then f*cking well leave before the end ! Otherwise wait your turn, help those that may need it and accept you may be a tad late out of the ground. Christ many of you live within 20 miles of Plainmoor, i have to drive 300 miles home after my games yet i'd be prepared to help an elderly Gulls fan who needs it. Yes the club need to address these safety concerns and i'm sure they will but we as fans should all stick together and help one another.

[ferrarilover]

Thank you Matt.Your post confirms that the matter was considered but the wrong decision was made.
The construction of the Bench is the best thing to happen to Plainmoor, as a Stadium, in the history of the club. All fans are delighted with the wonderful new stand but I hope you accept that it is not a question of impatience but fear of a serious accident that drives some of us to take this matter so seriously.

Not even slightly. With the information you have in this thread, you must surely be able to see that it was a case of weighing the safety of ALL spectators (no matter how that may be arbitrarily determined) some of the time against the safety of infirm spectators all of the time.

Indeed, the decision which was made was perfect. Install no handrail and allow time for studies to show that A. they are, in fact, necessary and not a complete waste of time and money and B. That there is sufficient leniency in the safety regulations and our performance in compliance with these regulations that the addition of a handrail will not have any tangible detrimental effect.

A handrail means greater escape time, greater escape time means reduced capacity, reduced capacity makes the Bench financially unjustifiable and we end up stuck with the old Grandstand forever. It is on decisions such as these that entire projects succeed or fail.

Does anybody here think that the Bench was created without a single thought, that we just pulled down the Grandstand, tapped Thea et al for a few quid and knocked up the Bench however the hell happened to be cheapest and quickest?
Does anyone here think that the club did consider putting in a handrail, but decided that it would be fun to see how many old people we could kill every week?

The club made the best decision it could in all the circumstances. As it turns out, the correct decision was made, because a fortnight from now, we will have a Bench which has the capacity we need and want, which complies with the safety guidelines and also has a handrail to keep little old Ethel from falling and breaking her hip. Everybody wins.

[Gullscorer]

Escape time..?? What on earth will people sitting on the bench potentially be required to escape from..?

Not the football, surely..? =D

Better install escape chutes at the back of the stand... =D

[bengull]

The escape time is already slow due to the lack of exit points. The only exit at full time is the one shared with the family stand, and in the occurrence of both stands being near full you could have 2500 filtering into the same point. As I remember, the rickety old grandstand did have exits through the stand which were blocked off or condemned on health and safety grounds. I wonder whether the club considered a modern equivalent of these exits when building?

In my only exprience of the bench gainst Stoke it took 10 minutes to exit the ground, I am pretty sure there is a law that states in case of fire the ground must be evacuated quicker than that? Bearing in mind the family stand was near enough empty that night I would imagine it to be chaos in the event of a full house. Maybe the club need to think about utilising the exit at the family stand end of the pop, with the option for family standees to exit there too. What is the reason for that exit being closed? Used it all the time back in the day.

Not criticising the club because what we have now is excellent and space age compared to the previous monstrosity, and as a popside it won't ever effect me. It just seems curious, when you look at equivalent modern day stadia, that the stand was built in such a way that it is impossible to vacate without a stampede. These are the sort of teething problems we need to foresee now and nip in the bud before we get caught with our trousers down and someone gets hurt.

[ferrarilover]

Again, no Ben, they didn't consider something as trivial as exits, they let the tea lady design the Bench... 8/

There isn't law (that I am aware of, but then I haven't looked), but there is regulation. That regulation is 8 minutes and when timed, we have not failed. The exit you mentioned was brought up at a recent meeting and there was no answer provided that I recall. However, it has been mentioned before and we were given some old chat, as usual, about the Health and Safety brigade somehow managing to believe that fewer exits are better.

There needn't be a stampede, just everyone, correctly directed, using the most available exit and efficient method of escape. In the case of a genuine emergency, we won't have people stood about, playing with mobile phones, clapping the players off the pitch, chatting, eating chips or drinking tea. We are a club with a large percentage of elderly fans, it will take us a little bit longer and we will have to be a little bit more careful than some other clubs. In just the same way that it takes longer to evacuate an old folks home than it does a primary school.

Be cool people, it's all coming together nicely.

Matt.