Player Fitness

[Bristol_Gull]

Read how one of the many part-time clubs to out-think and out-perform 'full-time' United go about their business......
http://www.thenationalleague.org.uk/beh ... he-n-40239

This is fantastic and shows in the results!

There is a lot to be learned from this article and its not just about player fitness...it's about teamwork, winning mentality, commitment, and preparation.

[Mattpuma]

No-one complained about fitness when we finished the last two seasons stronger than other sides. If I am a supporter of Kevin Nicholson then I could use the examples that we finished strongly in both seasons under Nicholson as proof that his training and fitness programmes must be better than other teams - but it would just be the same confirmation bias from the other extreme.

As a more general point, and as with pretty much every other topic on this board, the reality of the situation is that for the last 2.5 years we've been at the lowest ebb in the club's entire history and in that situation you're not going to get many examples of groundbreaking success. If as a club you're unable to afford transport to take your first team to first team fixtures then it's fair to say there's not much in the way of infrastructure to expect a 'professional club'.

The best long-term judge of how well Kevin Nicholson actually did in the circumstances he was in will be the managers that came in before and after him. We know that Paul Cox walked away after 10 games because the money the club could afford to pay was not enough for him & he didn't want to work under those circumstances. On the pitch, his side had 10 points after 10 games, which is a ratio that would get you relegated.

Owers is coming in now in a reasonably similar situation to Nicholson, who was appointed 2 years ago today. After a slow start he did turn us around and got 31 points from the final 15 games. Overall Nicholson picked up 41 points from 34 games, and if Owers does the same ratio over his 36 games, we'd pick up 44 points during his spell and finish on 47 points.

That might not be enough to survive, but the team he is inheriting now does at least have some quality in it, it is just too small and with too many injured at one time. On paper at least it is a long way above the quality of the Geohaghon, Fenwick, Carmichael, Briscoe, Lavelle-Moore etc that started the 3-7 Bromely fixture before Nicholson took over. I suspect that is the basis of his 'lottery' comments that have been so badly received given our current position.

Yes those 4 wins in the last 10 games last season (including 1 against a team already relegated) really showed our superior fitness as we demolished all opposition.

You must have selective memory. Plenty of people have been complaining about player fitness for a long while. Just check our appalling goals scored record in the last 15 minutes of games last season.

[Jerry]

And yes, when we went on winning runs, no-one thought to comment how unfit the players looked. If you want a very rough sample, then there have been 86 posts on here using the word fitness since the season began, and 9 for the same spell at the end of last season - 4 of which were Dan Sparkes failing a fitness test before a game.

Because of course this is the only place people talk about TUFC :}

Are you honestly surprised that people are more likely to flag up issues when the team is losing than when they are winning? Doesn't mean that those issues have gone away.

You imply Nicholson's regime meant that the players fitness improved over the course of the season resulting in better form toward the end. Even if this is the case it is still unacceptable in my eyes, the players should be at a consistently good level of fitness all season so that the need for last minute "great escapes" is removed.

I appreciate you live a long way from Torquay and so maybe don't socialise with many Gulls fans but I can assure you that in the real world (ie not forums/facebook etc) people who have been at Plainmoor every other week for the last couple of seasons have consistently been talking about the players fitness, irrespective of winning runs.

[Jerry]

Read how one of the many part-time clubs to out-think and out-perform 'full-time' United go about their business......
http://www.thenationalleague.org.uk/beh ... he-n-40239

Not sure they are really any more part time than us. They train 3 times a week which is pretty much what we do isn't it? Their training sessions are during the day as well so it's not as if the players are combining "normal" nine to five jobs with playing football. I would imagine for most of them football is their only job.

[merse btpir]

Not sure they are really any more part time than us. They train 3 times a week which is pretty much what we do isn't it? Their training sessions are during the day as well so it's not as if the players are combining "normal" nine to five jobs with playing football. I would imagine for most of them football is their only job.

As it is at most progressive part-time clubs; to the best of my knowledge Duane Ofori-Acheampong has never done anything else than play part-time football since he left United for Dover and now Dartford. He lives at home with his mum to be of company and to care for her after the loss of her daughter and then Duane's dad and that helps keep his cost of living down also.

Nearly every part-time footballer I know is a footballer first and some do something else that fits in with their life-style, study or rely entirely on their football money. Training in the day-time for three days a week is little different than 'full-time' and remember travelling to and returning from away games has to be factored in; a good deal of midweek football too ~ especially in the period before Christmas ~ and in many cases, fitness and conditioning has to be done in addition in their 'own time' to allow maximum time to be devoted to ball work and tactical stuff when they are all together as a squad with management.

Woking's version of part-time is a hybrid style in a transitionary period between the part-time era of Garry Hill and the graduated transition to full-time under Anthony Limbrick in much the same way than Boreham Wood progressed from part-time under Ian Allinson, through a hybrid to the now full-time era of Luke Garrard.

Allinson left Boreham Wood to remain part-time and took the Saint Albans City job because he did not want to give up his 'day job' with Carlsberg and a very young Garrard progressed from being Head of Academy and his assistant manager to taking over with enormous success.

What sets these clubs apart from Torquay United is that they have genuine footballing infrastructure with a pyramid of teams below their first team; United have nothing! At Boreham Wood the next team 'down' is the under 19s playing in exactly the same manner and training identically to the first team because their management is the same management as the first team and then it goes on down to the (3) u18 teams and (3) u17 teams.......all coached by first team players and overseen by the first team management structure. I don't know about Woking but I do know that Dagenham is exactly the same structure of teams without the multiple numbers of u18s & 17s.

Luke Gerrard works fantastically long hours and is too busy to be on facebook making friends; visiting hospitals and taking part in the community events on more than the rare occasion, and I don't doubt it is any different for Anthony Limbrick either because these young managers have their priorities right and their teams at the right end of the league table!

[Gulliball]

Because of course this is the only place people talk about TUFC :}

Are you honestly surprised that people are more likely to flag up issues when the team is losing than when they are winning? Doesn't mean that those issues have gone away.

You imply Nicholson's regime meant that the players fitness improved over the course of the season resulting in better form toward the end. Even if this is the case it is still unacceptable in my eyes, the players should be at a consistently good level of fitness all season so that the need for last minute "great escapes" is removed.

I appreciate you live a long way from Torquay and so maybe don't socialise with many Gulls fans but I can assure you that in the real world (ie not forums/facebook etc) people who have been at Plainmoor every other week for the last couple of seasons have consistently been talking about the players fitness, irrespective of winning runs.

Well, you're welcome to go round other places if you'd like to. It may help you remember who the opposition players and managers who 'flagged up' our poor fitness were.

People are more likely to be generally critical, negative, look for problems when we are losing yes, that was one point I was trying to make. There will always be over-emotional and reactionary posts when we're losing games, and there's been plenty of examples of that over the last 4-5 years. We've lost an awful lot of games in that time, across numerous owners, managers and playing squads, and I would say the biggest reason for this is, shock horror, being a poorer, worse run club with a lower quality side. Given the off-field issues this has co-incided with, I wouldn't blame any of the managers for not getting results, be it Cox, Nicholson or Owers.

I actually said that was the other extreme example of confirmation bias and equally as wrong as lose = unfit.

Well, thank-you. I'll be sure to see if I can meet one of these real life fans when I'm at Plainmoor next Tuesday. I might learn something. In the meantime, I was one of the 49 at Barrow last weekend, and will be travelling down to Dagenham on Saturday, so I'll have to make up my own mind.

[tomogull]

Boreham Wood - mid-table and dropping. Not the best of examples to bore us with ........

[merse btpir]

Boreham Wood - mid-table and dropping. Not the best of examples to bore us with ........

It bores you because you are a chip on the shoulder bigot. Boreham Wood is a prime example of just how much the football club YOU support is under achieving so I would suggest the subject of my post is not boring 'us' but boring you!

If you object so much to me posting on here you are at liberty to scroll on or even block my posts from your view of the site but then you would have very little to comment on would you.......censor your own view on life; not other's

[westyorkshiregull]

It's one thing being bottom and another being bottom with little outlook had how things are going to improve in the future. No reserves , no youth setup as such and not much unity between fans and owners. Best we can hope for in next 12 months is to keep going even if relegated.

[tomogull]

Luke Gerrard works fantastically long hours and is too busy to be on facebook making friends; visiting hospitals and taking part in the community events on more than the rare occasion, and I don't doubt it is any different for Anthony Limbrick either because these young managers have their priorities right and their teams at the right end of the league table!

Luke Gerrard is fortunate to be at a club which is well run and supportive - a 'luxury' not enjoyed by a Torquay manager for five seasons or more. However, if as you say and imply that 'he works fantastically long hours and is too busy for frivolities such as visiting hospitals', then he won't succeed and this is indicated by his team's mid-table mediocrity, only a handful of points above the relegation places. Successful managers in all works of life know the importance of a good work-life balance. Sir Alex Ferguson is a prime example.

I would remind you that Torquay's most successful manager, Frank O'Farrell who the likes of Luke Gerrard will never emulate, regularly visited the Children's Ward at Torbay Hospital and encouraged his players to do likewise. I can vouch for the lift this gave to kids to break the mundane of hospital routine to have a visit from someone known in the community, be it a footballer, singer or even a councillor. So don't you dare belittle these acts of kindness for the purpose of your vindictive vendetta.

[tomogull]

It bores you because you are a chip on the shoulder bigot. Boreham Wood is a prime example of just how much the football club YOU support is under achieving so I would suggest the subject of my post is not boring 'us' but boring you!

If you object so much to me posting on here you are at liberty to scroll on or even block my posts from your view of the site but then you would have very little to comment on would you.......censor your own view on life; not other's

Me got a chip on my shoulder ??? Ho, ho - the words pot, kettle and black spring readily to mind ! You obviously missed my intended 'play on words' - Boreham and Boring. I understand that fans of other clubs in the locality refer to B.W. as Boring Wood.

I shall continue to take a cursory scan through your posts and I will continue to put an alternative point of view where I am moved to do so. And I hope all other Forum users will do the same.

[Dave]

This is Gareth Law talking about last seasons injuries.. then compare to this this seasons injuries. Of course there are some exceptions, but I can see a pattern emerging.

[wivelgull]

I am with you tomogull, together (and with brucie perhaps!) we will stand up to these pontificating bullies.

[merse btpir]

'he works fantastically long hours and is too busy for frivolities such as visiting hospitals'

You posted (as I quote above) insinuating that I had described hospital visits as 'frivolous' by encasing your version in parenthesis giving the impression that this was an accurate representation of what I had actually posted which was: Luke Gerrard works fantastically long hours and is too busy to be on facebook making friends; visiting hospitals and taking part in the community events on more than the rare occasion. I patently did not describe hospital visiting as frivolous.

It's not difficult to cut, paste and quote accurately but this seems beyond you; when you quote in future take care to do so accurately and truthfully.

[tomogull]

I am with you tomogull, together (and with brucie perhaps!) we will stand up to these pontificating bullies.

Cheers for that, Wivel. Good away win against Buxton for the Seasiders on Tuesday night. They're moving nicely up the table now - should be a good game at home to Barwell tomorrow - good luck.