Is Hargreaves fit for purpose?

[Sesimbra]

I raised this question 3 weeks ago and the general consensus was that Hargreaves is fit for purpose. Since then Torquay have lost every match and seem to be on a downward spiral.
I fervently believe that we have a fairly decent Conference Squad but it seems our manager is unable to galvanise the team into performing on match day which is his responsibility.
It may be that he does not get the respect from his players which he enjoyed in his playing days.
I still believe that he is not managerial material but I would be happy if I am proved wrong.
I am normally an optimist but I can only foresee United in the bottom half of the table at best unless Hargreaves gets his act together and accepts responsibility.

[Dave]

From when Chris Hargreaves took over to the end of last season he was managing the team under little pressure from us fans, many said the damage was done before he got here, and forgave him for not keeping us up as it wasn't his team. Now we're at a lower level and this is his team, the first test of Chris Hargreaves' managerial ability was always going to come when the team hit it's first bad run of form ,you might be right sesimbra , for me it's still early to say CH will not get a positive response form the team.

If he doesn't however, then the club are faced with finding money out of the next budget to sack him, and what sort of manager will the club attract with the budget levels we're offering now, another untried and tested rookie, not entirely sure what the answer is now.

[arcadia]

He's made a few mistakes but been let down by a few players. He needs to change the system away from home but needs to talk to experience people before making his big decisions. Chris has to improve and with every ones support he will, as we need him to be successful.

[SuperNickyWroe]

From when Chris Hargreaves took over to the end of last season he was managing the team under little pressure from us fans, many said the damage was done before he got here, and forgave him for not keeping us up as it wasn't his team. Now we're at a lower level and this is his team, the first test of Chris Hargreaves' managerial ability was always going to come when the team hit it's first bad run of form ,you might be right sesimbra , for me it's still early to say CH will not get a positive response form the team.

If he doesn't however, then the club are faced with finding money out of the next budget to sack him, and what sort of manager will the club attract with the budget levels we're offering now, another untried and tested rookie, not entirely sure what the answer is now.

the thing is dave, as we have discussed many times - the most important thing was our league status and the money we would lose if relegated.

im sure now that the board wish they'd have chosen someone with the relevant experience - and associated cost - to have kept us in the football league and avoid the situation - which will be long term - that we are in now.

[PhilGull]

the thing is dave, as we have discussed many times - the most important thing was our league status and the money we would lose if relegated.

im sure now that the board wish they'd have chosen someone with the relevant experience - and associated cost - to have kept us in the football league and avoid the situation - which will be long term - that we are in now.

But that would only have been a short-term gain. Do you really want to see a return to the Bateson days of experienced managers being appointed in February or March to save us from relegation only to be sacked 12 months later for someone else to come in and save us.
As I have said many times before, we need to look at young inexperienced managers, yes they may turn out to be rubbish but they may not, better that than an experienced manager who we know is rubbish. Every single experienced manager that we could ever hope to employ has a CV full of failure, if not then they would never be interested in managing us.
All of our success has come with inexperienced managers, Buckle, Rosenior, Hodges. Give Hargreaves a chance, he's not even been in the job for a year yet. He put together what I think almost everyone regarded as a decent squad in the summer and we enjoyed a good run earlier, not so good at the moment but the manager, like the players, is still learning.

[hector]

the thing is dave, as we have discussed many times - the most important thing was our league status and the money we would lose if relegated.

im sure now that the board wish they'd have chosen someone with the relevant experience - and associated cost - to have kept us in the football league and avoid the situation - which will be long term - that we are in now.

I suspect Sturrock would have kept us up, although the damage was done by Hargreaves's predecessor and the legacy of Knill's mis-management is one we are still suffering from with half the squad, Knill's overpaid, under-performing detritus.

I think next season was always going to be the one that we judge Hargreaves on. He will have no excuses then although the budget will be even smaller. It is such a shame, that what looked like an unexpected promotion challenge, a couple of months ago, has already led some to start thinking about relegation.

I just find myself slowly trying to emotionally wean myself off TUFC because when I think back to less than three years ago, when we completed that easy and wonderful double over Plymouth, to the sorry state we are in now, it is all so unnecessary and enough to make you feel incredibly angry and I just cannot be bothered to constantly be feeling let down by this football club anymore.

So whether it is Hargreaves, or someone else, I'm getting past caring because a bleak future for TUFC is pretty much assured and I don't want to get my hopes up. Hargreaves has made some errors but to be honest, this season is panning out pretty much how must of us imagined it would and I can't see the club sacking him, unless we were ensconced in the relegation mire.

[Burnhamgull]

I'm with SNW and had severe doubts about his appointment.

He was appointed and there was very little bounce factor. Some blame the number of postponements but I don't agree with that. He still had 3-4 months to get the necessary results and maintain our league status. The style of play was terrible, there appeared to be no clear pattern of how we should play and certain players appeared to be going through the motions in order to collect their salary each week and showed no interest in the plight of the club. Some players were played when they clearly weren't up to the job. I refer to Mansell in particular.

Relegation meant a reduction in finance and CH has had to recruit whatever he could and there are some players who, in my opinion, have been a success. Young, Richards, Briscoe. Bowman started well and has sunk faster than a Maylasian Airlines plane, Pearce appears to have gone off the radar but what worries me more is the lack of discipline that has lost us key players already this season. My abiding memory of this season so far is watching CH view the second half at Telford through a glass door in the corner of the ground.

We're out of the FA Cup (thank god lost too), we're mid table and I think that would be a decent finish for us right now. I don't think we'll get sucked into a relegation battle because there are some truly terrible teams in this league.

Like Hector though, I've lost a lot of the passion for the club that I had in the past. Last season I spent a long time considering whether to renew my ST and enquired about a ST for Bristol City. Only the intervention of the family meant I ended up with a ticket for Plainmoor this year and whilst I watch the results at Ashton Gate every week, I do regret the decision that was made for me.

[brucie]

The football at the start of the season was good. The team was winning and to be honest it was like a breath of fresh air. I attended every home game up to Dover as the football was exciting and I found myself looking forward to every match again. We were on a fantastic run and really there was a sense of pride in our club again.
However since then its all gone completely pear shaped as we have been disgraced against a succession of bloody awful teams.
Its been a complete debacle,a shambles, a complete disgrace. The only saving grace is that we are still within touching distance of the play offs.
There is just simply no excuse for our dire run against a succession of teams that we should quite easily be able to compete with. Yes we might be hamstrung by Knills signing but really if the likes of Nicholson and Hawley are inflicting defeats on us then there looks to be little hope.
Personally I think that Hargreaves made a massive mistake by not recalling Pearce to the defence early in the season when he got over his injury. Had he been a regular we would have had our best player match fit by now.
The next three or four games are now key. Win them and we still have a great chance of doing something this season. However in probability we will keep losing and all goodwill,enthusiasm and everything else will go down the swanee. The fans will vote with their feet in droves.

[PlainmoorRoar]

The football at the start of the season was good. The team was winning and to be honest it was like a breath of fresh air. I attended every home game up to Dover as the football was exciting and I found myself looking forward to every match again. We were on a fantastic run and really there was a sense of pride in our club again.
However since then its all gone completely pear shaped as we have been disgraced against a succession of bloody awful teams.
Its been a complete debacle,a shambles, a complete disgrace. The only saving grace is that we are still within touching distance of the play offs.
There is just simply no excuse for our dire run against a succession of teams that we should quite easily be able to compete with. Yes we might be hamstrung by Knills signing but really if the likes of Nicholson and Hawley are inflicting defeats on us then there looks to be little hope.
Personally I think that Hargreaves made a massive mistake by not recalling Pearce to the defence early in the season when he got over his injury. Had he been a regular we would have had our best player match fit by now.
The next three or four games are now key. Win them and we still have a great chance of doing something this season. However in probability we will keep losing and all goodwill,enthusiasm and everything else will go down the swanee. The fans will vote with their feet in droves.

Probably a lie.

Although you were there for the Southport game, making unnecessary trouble in the home end.

[goodluckgull]

I still believe Greavsie is a good manager for Torquay United. I wish more fans were able to attend training sessions and they would witness the excellent skills of Greavsie. it seems to me that he has total respect from all our players. The atmosphere at training is good and upbeat. Also if you could get to a training session you would see that Ryan Bowman is one of the best finishers at the club.....the goals will come.

[Gloomy Gull]

I still believe Greavsie is a good manager for Torquay United. I wish more fans were able to attend training sessions and they would witness the excellent skills of Greavsie. it seems to me that he has total respect from all our players. The atmosphere at training is good and upbeat. Also if you could get to a training session you would see that Ryan Bowman is one of the best finishers at the club.....the goals will come.

Does he look like a good finisher in training but cannot re-create that in games, because OUR defence is weak?

[goodluckgull]

Ryan has certainly got frustrated during recent games. There are many reasons for that, but he has got the ability.

[SuperNickyWroe]

I'm with SNW and had severe doubts about his appointment.

He was appointed and there was very little bounce factor. Some blame the number of postponements but I don't agree with that. He still had 3-4 months to get the necessary results and maintain our league status. The style of play was terrible, there appeared to be no clear pattern of how we should play and certain players appeared to be going through the motions in order to collect their salary each week and showed no interest in the plight of the club. Some players were played when they clearly weren't up to the job. I refer to Mansell in particular.

Relegation meant a reduction in finance and CH has had to recruit whatever he could and there are some players who, in my opinion, have been a success. Young, Richards, Briscoe. Bowman started well and has sunk faster than a Maylasian Airlines plane, Pearce appears to have gone off the radar but what worries me more is the lack of discipline that has lost us key players already this season. My abiding memory of this season so far is watching CH view the second half at Telford through a glass door in the corner of the ground.

We're out of the FA Cup (thank god lost too), we're mid table and I think that would be a decent finish for us right now. I don't think we'll get sucked into a relegation battle because there are some truly terrible teams in this league.

Like Hector though, I've lost a lot of the passion for the club that I had in the past. Last season I spent a long time considering whether to renew my ST and enquired about a ST for Bristol City. Only the intervention of the family meant I ended up with a ticket for Plainmoor this year and whilst I watch the results at Ashton Gate every week, I do regret the decision that was made for me.

cheers Burnhamgull......

glad its not just me.

[SuperNickyWroe]

But that would only have been a short-term gain. Do you really want to see a return to the Bateson days of experienced managers being appointed in February or March to save us from relegation only to be sacked 12 months later for someone else to come in and save us.
As I have said many times before, we need to look at young inexperienced managers, yes they may turn out to be rubbish but they may not, better that than an experienced manager who we know is rubbish. Every single experienced manager that we could ever hope to employ has a CV full of failure, if not then they would never be interested in managing us.
All of our success has come with inexperienced managers, Buckle, Rosenior, Hodges. Give Hargreaves a chance, he's not even been in the job for a year yet. He put together what I think almost everyone regarded as a decent squad in the summer and we enjoyed a good run earlier, not so good at the moment but the manager, like the players, is still learning.

phil, short term?

at least one more season in the football league?

then yes - every time.

[SuperNickyWroe]

I still believe Greavsie is a good manager for Torquay United. I wish more fans were able to attend training sessions and they would witness the excellent skills of Greavsie. it seems to me that he has total respect from all our players. The atmosphere at training is good and upbeat. Also if you could get to a training session you would see that Ryan Bowman is one of the best finishers at the club.....the goals will come.

without being/sounding harsh - training counts for nothing.

as for the "skills" of CH - im still to be convinced.