Levi Ives?

[arcadia]

Have you ever been in a situation where a young player is good enough but lacks strength and experience and you want to play him. This is to gain the experience and he's the best you've got you try to protect the weakness they have. Ives has his faults but has the potential to go on. Young players have to start somewhere and they are not the finished article.

Lavercombe needs games at his age not being sub. every week, I would have thought SG being an ex keeper would think the same. What I was trying to say is Hargreaves tactics did not help Ives, an experience manager would not leave him isolated.
It's nice to see your still reading my posts SG you might learn something. By the way Forever it's what Paul Cox said at the meeting he expects all his players to work -ucking hard that mean track back and get forward ask him.

[Southampton Gull]

Ives proved he is far from good enough yet, his flaws leave the team exposed but its interesting how you would cover a young inexperienced player yet fail to do the same for an inexperienced manager

I've nothing to learn from you, perhaps how to play the village idiot but little else

[arcadia]

Ives proved he is far from good enough yet, his flaws leave the team exposed but its interesting how you would cover a young inexperienced player yet fail to do the same for an inexperienced manager

I've nothing to learn from you, perhaps how to play the village idiot but little else

STEADY WHO BITING NOW

[stefano]

STEADY WHO BITING NOW

Has one of you shagged the others wife or something?

[Dave]

Not going to turn this into a tit for tat, willy waving bore fest Arcadia. Merely pointing out, that you said on a number of occasions during the course of last season, Levi Ives is good enough so he's old enough ( unfortunately I can't find the posts, I know they are out there) You now tell us in your opinion he lacks strength and experience, if you can't see how that fly's in the face of your own argument, all I can do is shrug my shoulders and conclude I'm exchanging opinions with a brick wall.

One post of yours I did find was on this thread page 3 about 12 posts down when you said in response to Mattpuma.

http://www.torquayfans.com/forum/viewto ... 1&start=40

This is where you fall down, at this age the lad is you can see that he is a different class and it takes experience to spot this and I expect you will come back and say you have this. Hargreaves knows he's better and that's why I guess Cruise is not on a long contract. Cruise has improved going forward but defending will always be a problem for him. :

A player going missing every few weeks is disruptive to the squad as a player has to be dropped every few weeks.


Compare that view point, to what you're saying now, what's changed ? are you making it up as you go along ?

I have no doubt that a Paul Cox TUFC team will be both physically and mentally fitter than what Chris Hargreaves put out, but then, that will not be difficult, in fact considering the team last season looked like a bunch of over weight, unfit jellyfish I'm sure most managers would be able to improve on that. I have no doubt Paul Cox will remind our midfield not to neglect their defensive duties either, and there's nothing wrong with that.

What your suggesting in my opinion, is we double up on Ives to protect him, if you can't see that could/would cause more problems than it solves, I'm back to shoulder shrugging, with relief I never played for or watched one of your teams.

After all we're not talking about local youth or senior football, we're talking about professional football, and the smart arsed coaching staff sat in the opposition dugout will take all of 5 minutes to figure out we're protecting our left back, and exploit the spare man they have down our left sided defensive channel.

Would an experienced manager identifying his left back as lacking strength and experience, play that lad in his first 11 and adapt the tactics to protect him, thus inviting pressure down that side, NO., he wouldn't, what he would do in the case at TUFC, no reserve or development squad, he would find a suitable loan placement for the player to gain the strength and experience, as no professional manager worth his salt would put a young player in to the detriment of the first team.

Again in the case of TUFC what the manager would surely do, is phone around to see if there's an Adam Smith or Bailly Cargill out there, he could bring in on loan, a player who wouldn't need protecting, a player who could contribute to the attacking play, a bit like Nicho in his prime, rather than having a left back that needs a midfielder to race back every time we lose the ball to bail him out.

As for your viewpoint on Lavercombe Arcadia, I've no doubt Lavercombe is a competent and talented young keeper, more than capable of holding down a place in our team next season, but, if you think PC is going to bring in, an experienced keeper as a player/GK coach, and tell him he's going to be sat behind Lavercombe all season you must be barking mad.

What I expect PC will do, opinion only, is what most fit for purpose managers do, and tell both keepers they are joint no 1's, I expect PC will surely tell them, who has ownership of the shirt will have to maintain a high standard to retain his place, the keeper who's on the bench will have to take the jersey of the lad who's starting, it's called healthy competition.

[Southampton Gull]

STEADY WHO BITING NOW

You'll need to do far better than pull that old chestnut out of the bag, your 'expert' opinions are being exposed

[tommyg]

Has one of you shagged the others wife or something?

I thought that was Hector and your wife

[arcadia]

No it's my wife getting worried as SG's stalking me on every post.
SG does not like me giving my opinion and loves trying to put me down but I don't care because I try to give supporters a view from what a manager might do. Take it or leave it.
I think it must be because his opinion must be always right and it scares him that it might be wrong. Coaches are taught but you cannot teach instinct and you learn from mistakes in the game and I believe in my judgement having gained experience and a good time in football at a good level. Sorry if I offend anyone but I say it as I see it.

Added in 1 hour 58 minutes 9 seconds:

Not going to turn this into a tit for tat, willy waving bore fest Arcadia. Merely pointing out, that you said on a number of occasions during the course of last season, Levi Ives is good enough so he's old enough ( unfortunately I can't find the posts, I know they are out there) You now tell us in your opinion he lacks strength and experience, if you can't see how that fly's in the face of your own argument, all I can do is shrug my shoulders and conclude I'm exchanging opinions with a brick wall.

One post of yours I did find was on this thread page 3 about 12 posts down when you said in response to Mattpuma.

http://www.torquayfans.com/forum/viewto ... 1&start=40

This is where you fall down, at this age the lad is you can see that he is a different class and it takes experience to spot this and I expect you will come back and say you have this. Hargreaves knows he's better and that's why I guess Cruise is not on a long contract. Cruise has improved going forward but defending will always be a problem for him. :

A player going missing every few weeks is disruptive to the squad as a player has to be dropped every few weeks.

I'm not denying that your talking a lot of sense but if we were talking football we would most probably agree somewhere along the line. I know that Cox has to sign a keeper more experienced but this could hold Lavercombe back.
Ives should have been taken out of the side last season but Hargreaves did not have anyone else I know that but Ives has the potential to play at a higher level and what I am saying is that he could have been managed better especially if we had a better squad. Downes let Ives down in several games leaving him exposed and if you go back in my posts you will read that I suggested that Ives play as a wingback with three centre halves as I think this suits his game.


Compare that view point, to what you're saying now, what's changed ? are you making it up as you go along ?

I have no doubt that a Paul Cox TUFC team will be both physically and mentally fitter than what Chris Hargreaves put out, but then, that will not be difficult, in fact considering the team last season looked like a bunch of over weight, unfit jellyfish I'm sure most managers would be able to improve on that. I have no doubt Paul Cox will remind our midfield not to neglect their defensive duties either, and there's nothing wrong with that.

What your suggesting in my opinion, is we double up on Ives to protect him, if you can't see that could/would cause more problems than it solves, I'm back to shoulder shrugging, with relief I never played for or watched one of your teams.

After all we're not talking about local youth or senior football, we're talking about professional football, and the smart arsed coaching staff sat in the opposition dugout will take all of 5 minutes to figure out we're protecting our left back, and exploit the spare man they have down our left sided defensive channel.

Would an experienced manager identifying his left back as lacking strength and experience, play that lad in his first 11 and adapt the tactics to protect him, thus inviting pressure down that side, NO., he wouldn't, what he would do in the case at TUFC, no reserve or development squad, he would find a suitable loan placement for the player to gain the strength and experience, as no professional manager worth his salt would put a young player in to the detriment of the first team.

Again in the case of TUFC what the manager would surely do, is phone around to see if there's an Adam Smith or Bailly Cargill out there, he could bring in on loan, a player who wouldn't need protecting, a player who could contribute to the attacking play, a bit like Nicho in his prime, rather than having a left back that needs a midfielder to race back every time we lose the ball to bail him out.

As for your viewpoint on Lavercombe Arcadia, I've no doubt Lavercombe is a competent and talented young keeper, more than capable of holding down a place in our team next season, but, if you think PC is going to bring in, an experienced keeper as a player/GK coach, and tell him he's going to be sat behind Lavercombe all season you must be barking mad.

What I expect PC will do, opinion only, is what most fit for purpose managers do, and tell both keepers they are joint no 1's, I expect PC will surely tell them, who has ownership of the shirt will have to maintain a high standard to retain his place, the keeper who's on the bench will have to take the jersey of the lad who's starting, it's called healthy competition.

[Southampton Gull]

No it's my wife getting worried as SG's stalking me on every post.
SG does not like me giving my opinion and loves trying to put me down but I don't care because I try to give supporters a view from what a manager might do. Take it or leave it.
I think it must be because his opinion must be always right and it scares him that it might be wrong. Coaches are taught but you cannot teach instinct and you learn from mistakes in the game and I believe in my judgement having gained experience and a good time in football at a good level. Sorry if I offend anyone but I say it as I see it.

Hahahahaha, if only our team could benefit from the extensive knowledge of someone who managed a western league team.

Opinions are just that, opinions. Everyone can have one .................

PS. I think your missus might be interested, she's emailing me about not being able to login

[stefano]

I thought that was Hector and your wife

Like it tommyg! Although all we really did was try to keep the forum lively during the long boring close season last year, but then because the season turned into a bore fest as well we forgot there were other things to think about and kept going!

I've been a bit worried about hector lately as I have found myself agreeing with a couple of things he has said. It's only temporary though .... as soon as he is back blaming that nice Mr Knill for the rise of Islamic State I will be back on the case with a vengeance!

[arcadia]

Hahahahaha, if only our team could benefit from the extensive knowledge of someone who managed a western league team.

Opinions are just that, opinions. Everyone can have one .................

PS. I think your missus might be interested, she's emailing me about not being able to login

I think you miss understood she thought you were gay!

[taxilady]

I think everyone's been having log-in problems; I got answers from Danny & Louis, So it sounds like Dave's taking up the slack.... .

[Scott Brehaut]

Dave's been busy helping out with a bitch giving birth....

[taxilady]

&, back on topic....Levi's agent is still in talks about him potentially moving to another club : our DOF says we don't want anyone at the LWS who doesn't want to be here; if Levi goes, we get a bit of compensation for him.

[Scott Brehaut]

Currently being chased by Championship club Bristol City and League One Peterborough.

http://www.torquayheraldexpress.co.uk/u ... story.html