why do managers get great contracts?

ferrarilover · Post by **ferrarilover** » 05 Dec 2013, 18:27

Ok, I'll explain again, as if the Kindergarten level above wasn't sufficiently simple.

A club, Swinderby United, are in need of a first team manager. They advertise the situation vacant without mentioning the specifics of the contract they will be offering.
8 managers all apply for the job. Each is interviewed and told that the contract is game by game and the salary is £12/week with a win bonus of £4. This is the least the club could possibly hope to pay.
All 8 managers, understandably, laugh their socks off as they leave the Chairman's office.
With no manager, the first team is a shambles, half the players leave after 6 weeks, because they've had no training and are getting nowhere. By Christmas, SUFC are bottom of their division, having scored 0 points and conceded 1416 goals in 20 matches.
The club, understandably, is lumbering along on crowds of 3, each paying £15/match. This £45/fortnight doesn't quite cover the electricity bill, so the players aren't being paid and nor is anything else (apart from the leccy, obvs).
By June, the club is wound up by order of the High Court. Asset stripped and sold to pay the vast sums owed.

Meanwhile, the managers. Three of them work for TV (one BBC, one Sky, one BT). Two are in America, one working with the nation team and one at LA Galaxy. One has changed careers altogether and is now an MP and the other two found positions with other clubs in the UK.

Tell me again about all the power clubs hold?

Matt.

Neal · Post by **Neal** » 05 Dec 2013, 18:33

Gee are we offering £12 a week, way too much!!!! And the win bonus, don't worry we don't win, so that is safe, and we have a manager on thousands per week.

ferrarilover · Post by **ferrarilover** » 05 Dec 2013, 19:46

It's like talking to Siri...

Matt.

ferrarilover · Post by **ferrarilover** » 05 Dec 2013, 19:54

EddUK12 wrote:The club doesnt have to have a manager.

Nope, you're quite right. That's why, of, say, 1,000,000 professional and amateur adult clubs and another 5,000,000 kids and womens clubs in the world, all of them, without exception, have managers. Why oh why didn't they consult you first, they could have saved so much time and effort. Don't worry, I've forwarded on your post to the Board at Man Utd, adviding them that they can happily sack Moyes, since they don't need a manager. I'll be sure to let you know when my consultancy fee arrives so you can claim your share.

EddUK12 wrote: It needs someone to pick and motorvate players on a saturday thats true but that doesnt have to be a manager.

If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, only a fool would call it a horse.

EddUK12 wrote: I would bet if a club went to the captain of a club and said 'manager sacked and we want you to pick the team and motorvate etc' he wouldbe able to do.

Yup, he would, and you know what, he'd be called player/manager.

EddUK12 wrote: The italy 90 england went on record to say they spoke to the manager bobby robson and said they want to pick the team etc as what he was suggesting wasnt working for them. And they didnt do to badly did they?

Yup, you're quite right, all a manager ever does is pick the starting XI. That's his one and only job.

By jove man, you're some sort of footballing genius. I suggest you give Greg Dyke a ring in the morning to let him know of the outcome of your careful and detailed analysis of the game and the conclusions thereof. You'll be Sir Edd by the end of the week or I'm a Dutchman.

Matt.

taxilady · Post by **taxilady** » 05 Dec 2013, 20:12

perhaps Exeter City wouldn't bother to replace Tisdale if he gets offered the job at Fratton Park ? Then they could spend the money saved on improving their Away End !!!!!

Post by **Dave** » 05 Dec 2013, 20:36

Leroy took the title of head coach, he was the manager. Matt for so many reasons is spot on, for a start having a manager, also who that manager is can make a difference as to whether a player signs for the club or not.

Making the captain player/manager is all very well, there is so, so much more to being manager than just picking a team and motivating players, no player manager can or will be successful with out a head coach/assistant he has complete trust in, a player can't play and manage during a game, a player/manager can't train, and take training, and player manager who is also captain, can't be a captain and plan training sessions deal with F.A related admin attend meetings etc, there isn't enough hours in the day.

Matt is also right, the club doesn't have the power, I am a qualified youth football coach, if the club offered the minimum wage, I wouldn't take the job, already earn much more.

If the club offered £300 a week, they would be lucky to get a local level 2 coach, I've set out 2 reasons above why we need at least someone with a UFEA 'A' badge, so someone working as an assistant coach in say Chelsea's youth set up would have that, but are already earning about as much as we could afford to pay them, don't have a clue about League 2 or how it works, see local level 2 coach, and in a safe job.

I could go for hours about this subject, I work as a local U16's manager, and about 15 hrs of my week is taken up running the team, so god knows how much time is involved in running a professional football team, if Alan Knill isn't working close to 12 hours a day, I would be surprised. We must have a manager, we must have a manager who can deal with agents and attract players, we must have a manager who knows how League 2 works, to attract that, the club must offer the right contract.

ferrarilover · Post by **ferrarilover** » 05 Dec 2013, 20:50

taxilady wrote:perhaps Exeter City wouldn't bother to replace Tisdale if he gets offered the job at Fratton Park ? Then they could spend the money saved on improving their Away End !!!!!

Are you suggesting Tisdale is on £2,000,000/year. Seems generous... :~D

Matt.

ferrarilover · Post by **ferrarilover** » 05 Dec 2013, 20:53

EddUK12 wrote:Matt wasnt leroy first team coach? So no manager at that time. But im just being picky there.

Do you agree the club have all the power when sellecting their employees? And if that means not paying £50k and opting for someone on £25k then they can do that.

The point of this thread was to ask do clubs really need to give contracts on managers terms and not the clubs and the reason you gave that 'the club has no power' doesnt seem to add up.

Was maths never your strong point?

I'm not explaining it again. If you didn't understand either of the first two explanations, then you're not going to understand a third.

Matt.

Post by **Scott Brehaut** » 05 Dec 2013, 21:30

EddUK12 wrote: Im sure tescos dictate what they pay their staff.

Well, yes, they do - but Torquay are NOT in that position.

We COULD offer what we want, but there are plenty other "easier" jobs for better pay out there.
That's the point people are trying to make, yet it seems that you are the only one that doesn't get it!!

Post by **Scott Brehaut** » 05 Dec 2013, 22:05

EddUK12 wrote:I get people are wrong as they assume i am talking about TUFC when im talking about lower league football as a whole.

Well yes, we do think you're talking about Torquay - this is a TUFC website and you're posing in the "All things Plainmoor" section!!

Lets take a very recent example then:

Pulis at Palace....he turned them down, in other words would rather have been unemployed than be in a job that wasn't paying what he thought, until they paid what HE wanted to be paid.

Post by **SuperNickyWroe** » 05 Dec 2013, 22:31

EddUK12 wrote:And they had other options, he wasnt the only one to apply but yet again im talking about lower teir football which proves you are missing the point. Its about young managers being hungry and proving themselves and then moving on to bigger clubs and new challenges, its not about be comfortable and taking the easy option.

How many times do we hear 'where are the English managers?' well they are unwilling to take the risk prefering to be comfortable in a reserve team coaching role with a regular income for whatever reason.

As for this being about tufc they are in the lower teir of football (bottom of it last time i looked) which is what im talking about. By all means move this thread to another section if its more suitable

edd, im sorry mate but you have missed the point.

"options" yes clubs do have "options" its about who the club board/directors et al think who the best person is for the job - regardless of age, experience etc.
every club even in the lower tiers have a preferred choice and they will pay that peson accordingly.

Sunnysideup · Post by **Sunnysideup** » 05 Dec 2013, 23:52

EddUK12 wrote:I agree that there is alot more to being a manager then just picking the team but a director of football which is a long term part of the structure of the club look at perrymen at city, would free up alot of time and admin issues.

Great. So we're now at the point where we have a manager/coach that we probably play 30 to 40k because he has no experience as a 1st team manager and now a director of football as well? That's another 50 to 60k minimum out the window then. Are you really suggesting it would make sense to pay 2 people nigh on 100k instead of paying an experienced manager 75k?

That of course assumes you can find someone who actually know something about managing a professional team that would be willing to do the job for 30 to 40k in the first place.

I've seen some naive postings on here at times, but this really takes the biscuit...Maybe you should drop your CV into the club. Im sure they will find it fascinating reading.

ferrarilover · Post by **ferrarilover** » 05 Dec 2013, 23:55

You can lead a horse to water. ..

Matt.

Post by **Scott Brehaut** » 05 Dec 2013, 23:57

Yeah - I'm out of this one now I'm afraid....I'll only end up repeating myself.

Post by **Scott Brehaut** » 05 Dec 2013, 23:59

Yeah - I'm out of this one now I'm afraid....I'll only end up repeating myself.

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