TorquayFans.com | Torquay United Fans Forum

AustrianAndyGull wrote:Leadership is critical when you are going through a tough patch.

We don't have any from the top down.

2 and 2 make?

42 isn't it.

teeboo100 wrote: He is either ill not interested or just oblivious to the shambles that is going on around him at the moment.

Well does anyone know of a manger in torquay history that have been backed as much as alan has so far hes been allowed to bring in Chris brass he has a goalie coach various other technical coaches i e video annalists.

I respect your opinions on all things TUFC, however think your slightly wide of the mark here, Alan Knill is under pressure no doubt, but he is not ill, you will find he does care very much, and is well aware of our current situation, he didn't come here to screw up the club, and is trying to fix it, however bringing in loan after loan player personally I don't think that's the right way of solving our poor run.

On the second point, as already said Paul Buckle had all of that and more besides, including a transfer kitty.

Would a Fans' Forum,with Knill, Brass,Thea Bristow and Andy Candy present,help?
Could help the Knill build a relationship with the fans';answer some of the many questions/concerns posted on here,etc.
These have helped build bridges in the past and as long as criticism from fans' is constructive,generally helps "clear the air",and build some consensus about the way forward.

forevertufc wrote: I respect your opinions on all things TUFC, however think your slightly wide of the mark here, Alan Knill is under pressure no doubt, but he is not ill, you will find he does care very much, and is well aware of our current situation, he didn't come here to screw up the club, and is trying to fix it, however bringing in loan after loan player personally I don't think that's the right way of solving our poor run.

On the second point, as already said Paul Buckle had all of that and more besides, including a transfer kitty.

Pearce
Tonge
Harding
Hawley
Ball
McCallum
Azeez
O'Connor
Cameron
Chapell
Benyon
McCourt

I would say Knill has been backed pretty well. Buckle had to be reasonably backed because he inherited 3 players in his first season, he signed some loan players the year we did pretty well but other than that did Buckle get this much freedom or special treatment? Our group stayed quite similar throughout Buckle's tenure.

Poke/Bevan
Mansell
Robertson
Ellis
Nicholson
O'Kane
Wroe
Benyon
Stevens
Zebroski

Were the key cogs that spent a significant amount of time here, Knill has basically done what Buckle did in his first season and sign a whole new team give or take.

In fairness, you take out the loanees from you list for Knill and it is much shorter than Buckle's.

I'd hardly suggest either that Knilly is getting "special treatment". Were it not for a glut of injuries all at once, we wouldn't have signed any of the loanees, with the likely exception of Ball.

As much as we might want to find fault in all that Knill does, I really don't see that he can be particularly blamed for the way he has gone about getting in loanees to cover some of the absentees we have. There are two schools of thought on this and I seem to recall recently that we had a manager by the name of Ling who hated the loan market, kept referring to the answers "being in the building". I also remember a raft of loathing directed towards him for this from some, claiming that we had a paper thin squad and that we should be searchning for people better than Yeoman and Thompson.
This year, players like that are loaned out and loanee cover brought in and now, those very same people are having a pop because we're using loanees and not utilising the squad. Remarkably, some of them are clammering for the recall of the aforementioned squad players because "they're better than what we've already got".

Much like referees, all I (or anyone) really asks is consistency. Either Ling is a very naughty boy and he needs to dip into the loan market, and Yeoman is a tosser. Or Knill is an idiot for jusing loanees and giving away the prodigious talent of Yeoman and Thompson. You can't have it both ways, I'm afraid.

Matt.

ferrarilover wrote:Much like referees, all I (or anyone) really asks is consistency. Either Ling is a very naughty boy and he needs to dip into the loan market, and Yeoman is a tosser. Or Knill is an idiot for jusing loanees and giving away the prodigious talent of Yeoman and Thompson. You can't have it both ways, I'm afraid.

Matt.

Of course we can - we're football fans. We were born fickle

ferrarilover wrote:In fairness, you take out the loanees from you list for Knill and it is much shorter than Buckle's.

I'd hardly suggest either that Knilly is getting "special treatment". Were it not for a glut of injuries all at once, we wouldn't have signed any of the loanees, with the likely exception of Ball.

As much as we might want to find fault in all that Knill does, I really don't see that he can be particularly blamed for the way he has gone about getting in loanees to cover some of the absentees we have. There are two schools of thought on this and I seem to recall recently that we had a manager by the name of Ling who hated the loan market,
This year, players like that are loaned out and loanee cover brought in and now, those very same people are having a pop because we're using loanees and not utilising the squad. Remarkably, some of them are clammering for the recall of the aforementioned squad players because "they're better than what we've already got".

Much like referees, all I (or anyone) really asks is consistency. Either Ling is a very naughty boy and he needs to dip into the loan market, and Yeoman is a tosser. Or Knill is an idiot for jusing loanees and giving away the prodigious talent of Yeoman and Thompson. You can't have it both ways, I'm afraid.

Matt.

In my defence Matt I did actually say last season that I was generally happy with the players we had it was just that Ling didn't know how to get the best out of them, that extra 15 - 20%. They had become so used to beginning a game in a negative manner that it became impossible for them to get out of that mindset. My only problem with Ling was his refusal to have a go at teams and to be more attacking at times. I had not much of a problem with the squad until right at the death when some were saying they were just not good enough. Half of me thought this but I never truly believed it.

Knill just has be like Ling for the short term to redo all the dismantling of our whole structure that he has managed to undo. Go back to basics, get a preferred settled side and get them well drilled and hard to beat. Then we can take it from there. It won't be this year, no. This year has gone, it's a battle all the way to the finishing line this year thanks to the faffing around of Knill but if we and he survive then at least he will have platform next season from which to work.

So the answer was indeed in the building but Ling failed to put into practice what loads of us had been begging him to do for months and months - inject some energy into our play and use our attackers properly.

Not too bothered by Knills mannerisms and his inability to connect with the media. What worries me is that there was lot of talk about the magic ten games and the team needing time to gel with all the new signings.
The problem is that we now have more new signings than we had at the start of the season - which is totally bizarre.
If we could somehow fluke a win tomorrow (I know its unlikely) then things would look a little better.
I am not going because I cannot be arsed to ring up and get a ticket. Lets hope for a force nine gale which should make the game a complete lottery and somehow fluke a 1-0 win.
The more likely scenario is another defeat which probably wouldn't be the end of the world.
But after tomorrow we really couldn't afford to lose to Bury to Accrington.

royalgull wrote: Pearce
Tonge
Harding
Hawley
Ball
McCallum
Azeez
O'Connor
Cameron
Chapell
Benyon
McCourt

I would say Knill has been backed pretty well. Buckle had to be reasonably backed because he inherited 3 players in his first season, he signed some loan players the year we did pretty well but other than that did Buckle get this much freedom or special treatment? Our group stayed quite similar throughout Buckle's tenure.

Poke/Bevan
Mansell
Robertson
Ellis
Nicholson
O'Kane
Wroe
Benyon
Stevens
Zebroski

Were the key cogs that spent a significant amount of time here, Knill has basically done what Buckle did in his first season and sign a whole new team give or take.

Missed the point Ian, Buckle paid £10k for Wroe, £15k for Phillips and £25k for Zebroski, Buckle didn't have to pay these transfer fees, he did because he could.

Show me were Alan Knill has had that backing his squad was brought in for £0, Buckle had an assistant, goalkeeper coach, Buckle brought in goeff Harrop to the club, Buckle brought in the sports therapist and video analysis, Martin Ling and Alan Knill inherited those staff, just brought in there own assistants.

So how has Alan Knill had all this magical backing that Teeboo refers to.

I think this is all semantics. What we do have is a set of players who are more than good enough to not be where we are in the table. Why then are we 3rd bottom (and pretty much in the same spot before injuries)?

royalgull wrote: On the second point, as already said Paul Buckle had all of that and more besides, including a transfer kitty.

Pearce
Tonge
Harding
Hawley
Ball
McCallum
Azeez
O'Connor
Cameron
Chapell
Benyon
McCourt

I would say Knill has been backed pretty well. Buckle had to be reasonably backed because he inherited 3 players in his first season, he signed some loan players the year we did pretty well but other than that did Buckle get this much freedom or special treatment? [/quote]

Er ...... how could you forget our 'saviour' - Damien Mozika ???

Give me paul buckles signings any day of the week. Far superior!

Buckle made some excellent signings that served the club well and became folklore legends - Nicholson, Sills, Hargreaves, O'Kane, Ellis amongst others, while also signing some duds Jody Banim, Iysedyn Christie etc.

However, Buckle HAD to make more signings at the start because he didn't have enough players to field a team, let alone a squad. And that team that Buckle signed at the start of our first non-league season, even though some of the players like Sills, Todd, Hargreaves, struggled when we went up into the league, would wipe the floor with the current side.

I really am not keen on Buckle after the way he treated us during the build-up to Old Trafford but I preferred life as a TUFC fan under his management than Knills.

hector wrote:Buckle made some excellent signings that served the club well and became folklore legends - Nicholson, Sills, Hargreaves, O'Kane, Ellis amongst others, while also signing some duds Jody Banim, Iysedyn Christie etc.

However, Buckle HAD to make more signings at the start because he didn't have enough players to field a team, let alone a squad. And that team that Buckle signed at the start of our first non-league season, even though some of the players like Sills, Todd, Hargreaves, struggled when we went up into the league, would wipe the floor with the current side.

I really am not keen on Buckle after the way he treated us during the build-up to Old Trafford but I preferred life as a TUFC fan under his management than Knills.