Torquay United Fans Forum

Just to clarify, i'm not saying that having a loved one in a nursing home with dementia compares to how one feels about a football club because whilst they are both emotive, clearly one is by some considerable distance more important than the other. I was just trying to use that analogy as an example to explain how i see the football club now with my eyes and have or had no intention of offending anyone, especially anyone who may be going through or has gone through similar circumstances.

Agree tomo. The club is effectively dead yet obviously it still exists but if i may use an analogy to explain where i'm coming from and i apologize in advance because it might be considered inappropriate to some but it's not meant to be.

You are 65 years old and your wife of 70 is in a care home with severe dementia. She is there every day existing as a shell of the woman you once knew but she doesn't know who you are or care who you are anymore. You go and visit but ultimately there is nothing you can do to make things better. It's just a case of going through the motions until the inevitable happens. Even though your wife is still alive and in the care of others you have to come to terms with and accept the fact that you have to move on down a different path now. Even though it's sad and heartbreaking when this realization sets in. It is the only way you can stop living in the past and living in false hope.

IMO, Torquay fans are simply helping to pay for the 'palliative care' of the club to the 'carer' Mr Osborne but there is no real hope of it surviving long term. Accept this and move on. Either form a new club, go and support another local club or whatever or just don't go to any footy at all. All three are ways to move forward. Continuing to attend doesn't seem to be helping anyone based on evidence from the last 5 or 6 years although that loyalty inside tricks you into thinking it's the right thing to do. The right thing to do often isn't the easiest thing to do. Is the easiest thing to do perhaps to keep trotting off to games hoping whilst maybe the hardest is to acknowledge there is a terminal problem and take steps to move on, however unpopular this may be with others. It could be simply routine or habit or a deep guilt that lies there nagging you if you don't turn up. You could argue that it's a piece of piss to just stop going. It's easier to just stop going than get yourself ready, travel to the match, watch another dire defeat and then go again next game yes? In terms of effort then yes it's easier but in terms of wrestling with what you believe is the right thing to do then staying away is just as difficult as to continue attending.

I just keep coming back to clubs who have reformed and whilst they are lower down the pyramid than Torquay, they have come through adversity and are thriving. Scarborough had over 2,000 yesterday for their cup game with Hyde, have a compact new ground, are signing a host of ex league players and are still on the up. Hereford. Look at them as tomo points out. Winning all the time and progressing. Real hope and excitement. There are others. Torquay are like a knackered old greyhound. Tired, used and abused, washed up and seeing out the rest of their days in a dogs home. Maybe the reason why GI like to demolish dog tracks without replacing them. :}

Their dedication to animal welfare is appreciated. :}

Sarcasm aside. Knocking down greyhound tracks and not building new ones doesn't change my dislike of Osborne much but only 99% of me dislikes him now. That 1% shows me that he does indeed have a heart and cares about doing the right thing. Maybe Torquay will be ok after all? :)

[quote=hector post_id=214561 time=1508060265 user_id=8068]
Nicholson, Owers, Herrera, Hargreaves, O'Farrell - it probably doesn't matter because we're all playing along to Clarke Osborne's tune. The club is owned by a multi-million pound organisation, yet this pretty big club for the level we are at, is even worse off than it was under the David Phillips regime. GI have owned us for almost a year but all we have seen is decline on the field and a new kit and badge.

On the surface of it, the appointment of an experienced managerial team, should have seen some sort of positive impact. there are players in that squad who are better than the bottom of the National League, so we should be seeing some improvements or at least signs of it, and perhaps we are. The previous manager was poor, but if nothing changes with GI's own man in charge then I think some heat really needs to be turned back on Clarke Osborne.

Just what is the point of supporters, 'loyally' turning up each week when the club's own malevolent ownership appears to be conspiring against it? I just feel now, that when I go and hand over £15, I'm simply lining Clarke Osborne's pocket. Our football club is dead, succumbing to the parasites. It's like a zombie, masquerading as human, just sucking the life out of everyone remaining.

5 years ago, had we bumped into Clarke Osborne, we wouldn't have just handed him our money but that's what we do now.
[/quote]

And there you have it in a nutshell (although I don't agree that the previous manager was poor, but I don't want to start that hornet's nest buzzing again !!). As YorkieAndy and Budegull posted on another thread, the club is rotten at the core. We have a chairman who admits to not knowing anything about football and having no interest in the game. I wonder how many times Clarke Osborne has attended matches this season? We were promised a Board of local directors. Silence. Who is actually making decisions at the club? Is it solely Geoff Harrop - only in post because he is related to Osborne? There is absolutely no communication with fans. We're moving into a new stadium next season (only nine months away) - remember? Another of Gaming International's 'Castles in the Sky'. In fact, about the only thing going for the club is the fantastic loyalty of the fan base.

As Hector posts, it doesn't matter who the manager is. Until the club is run professionally off the field, we will continue to struggle and under-achieve as a club. Owers and Kuhl are already getting a bit of 'stick' from some impatient fans. But let's look at some of the clubs they have had to face - Macclesfield top of the league (beat us 1 - 0 following a suicidal back pass), Dagenham & Redbridge (away), another team that will probably be in the play-offs at the end of the season, Dover, second in the league (and a very good side in my book) and Aldershot yesterday who will also be up with the leaders and who were able to bring on players like McClure and Okejie (?) who would be first on the team sheet for us. It's been a baptism of fire for Gary & Martin. I hope they are able to keep us in the National League as the previous manager did, but they must know, as we already know, what a mammoth task they've got ahead. There is time ...... and as Hector posts, there are players in the squad who are better tnan bottom of the National League. A priority must be to bring in at least one striker from somewhere because if we don't score goals, we ain't going to win matches ! There were rumours during the summer about Ryan Brunt possibly coming to Plainmoor but he eventually signed for Exeter. He isn't being included in City's squad, so surely it would help him to have regular football somewhere else? However, I don't know what his injury situation is - perhaps he has had a recurrence which is keeping him out of the squad.

But clubs do bounce back from tough times. Hereford, a good club very much like TUFC, shafted by owners (and allegedly there was some involvement there by Gaming International, or one of their subsidiary companies, as well) in the same league as Tiverton at present but making their way back up the football pyramid. Their fans have remained loyal and were rewarded with a great win at Eastleigh yesterday. Good luck to them. So there is some hope ....... but there isn't any light at the end of the tunnel at the moment.

[quote="Nick Potkins" post_id=214564 time=1508061041 user_id=315]
Scott Rendell interview says it all about one goal being enough "did not think Torquay were ever going to hurt us"...
[/quote]

His interview is what I felt as well until, Young hit his free kick which the keeper saved at that time I thought we could get a draw as we were copping well at the back bar for one that hit a post.

The game was not as bad as people are suggesting most of us in the coach thought we did ok but you can see the wide players don't provide enough for the striker and midfield getting forward. There is no creative player in the middle Dowling could be the answer and Jordan Lee is a must as he will use his pace which our wide players do not use it enough.

Scott Rendell interview says it all about one goal being enough "did not think Torquay were ever going to hurt us"...

[quote=hector post_id=214561 time=1508060265 user_id=8068]
Nicholson, Owers, Herrera, Hargreaves, O'Farrell - it probably doesn't matter because we're all playing along to Clarke Osborne's tune. The club is owned by a multi-million pound organisation, yet this pretty big club for the level we are at, is even worse off than it was under the David Phillips regime. GI have owned us for almost a year but all we have seen is decline on the field and a new kit and badge.

On the surface of it, the appointment of an experienced managerial team, should have seen some sort of positive impact. there are players in that squad who are better than the bottom of the National League, so we should be seeing some improvements or at least signs of it, and perhaps we are. The previous manager was poor, but if nothing changes with GI's own man in charge then I think some heat really needs to be turned back on Clarke Osborne.

Just what is the point of supporters, 'loyally' turning up each week when the club's own malevolent ownership appears to be conspiring against it? I just feel now, that when I go and hand over £15, I'm simply lining Clarke Osborne's pocket. Our football club is dead, succumbing to the parasites. It's like a zombie, masquerading as human, just sucking the life out of everyone remaining.

5 years ago, had we bumped into Clarke Osborne, we wouldn't have just handed him our money but that's what we do now.
[/quote]

:goodpost:

Many players have left this club when the fans thought they were sh*te, mmmmm new thread coming :)

Nicholson, Owers, Herrera, Hargreaves, O'Farrell - it probably doesn't matter because we're all playing along to Clarke Osborne's tune. The club is owned by a multi-million pound organisation, yet this pretty big club for the level we are at, is even worse off than it was under the David Phillips regime. GI have owned us for almost a year but all we have seen is decline on the field and a new kit and badge.

On the surface of it, the appointment of an experienced managerial team, should have seen some sort of positive impact. there are players in that squad who are better than the bottom of the National League, so we should be seeing some improvements or at least signs of it, and perhaps we are. The previous manager was poor, but if nothing changes with GI's own man in charge then I think some heat really needs to be turned back on Clarke Osborne.

Just what is the point of supporters, 'loyally' turning up each week when the club's own malevolent ownership appears to be conspiring against it? I just feel now, that when I go and hand over £15, I'm simply lining Clarke Osborne's pocket. Our football club is dead, succumbing to the parasites. It's like a zombie, masquerading as human, just sucking the life out of everyone remaining.

5 years ago, had we bumped into Clarke Osborne, we wouldn't have just handed him our money but that's what we do now.

[quote=tufcyellowarmy post_id=214551 time=1508053230 user_id=19400]


I agree with this entirely. He is right though when he says that playing ok is one thing but we need something more to start winning games. After six games in charge we have seen the retun of some key players from injury and we still cant get over the line.
The trouble is he has no idea what it is we need other than just to plug away at cutting out the mistakes.
[/quote]

I had thought that after a month we would see some sort of improvement, based on the fact that I had believed that it takes 21 days or so to learn new habits. However, a little googling this morning reveals that it can take up to 66 days for automatic behaviours to bed in (with some people taking up to 254 days for new habits to become second nature). So we could be looking at gone the end of this season before some of our squad 'get it'.

Of course, one could argue that surely paid professionals - committed athletes - should take less time than us plebs to pick up new ways of doing things?

I wonder whether, when considering taking the job, Mr Owers looked at TUFC and thought: under-performing 'big'/league two club; just how hard can it be?

I think his bubble must have been well and surely burst (if it hadn't already) by the fact that we are so poorly regarded that even agents of third-rate* footballers can't be arsed to ensure their charges turn up to try out for us.

* No disrespect intended, but we're not Man City, really, are we?

[quote=gateman49 post_id=214508 time=1508001955 user_id=19069]
Just listened to GO's after match comments. I hope that I'm wrong but he doesn't sound as if he knows how to stop the rot.
[/quote]

I agree with this entirely. He is right though when he says that playing ok is one thing but we need something more to start winning games. After six games in charge we have seen the retun of some key players from injury and we still cant get over the line.
The trouble is he has no idea what it is we need other than just to plug away at cutting out the mistakes.

[b]I don't think the performance was as bad as some are saying and maybe are being guided by the result and being out of the Cup yet again before it has ever got started for us.....[/b]

That said, it wasn't that good either and the pitch looked a 'bit dead, tufty and long' after another game on it last night. The ball didn't 'fizz about' as it would on a really top notch condition surface of that sort of investment and that (I feel) contributed to the rather flat and slow motion atmosphere which left one mentally screaming [i][b]'this is an FA cup tie for goodness sake!'[/b][/i]

With people vocally on his back, Reid isn't going to exude the confidence and decision making his role demands and once again Young shrunk so far from where he could do some damage when we went a goal down; he might as well not have been out there for the last ten minutes. That was when sleeves needed to be rolled up, the game taken to the home side and a real effort to salvage a replay made. But there was nothing; it was as if they were content to play out a single goal defeat.........no leaders, no inspiration, no pride in performance ~ and then they come over looking for applause! :|

Just got back. The team played well today our problem area is the last third and the wide players are not producing any quality crosses. Murphy is playing back to goal and is an easy target to mark. We need to be more direct and I hope Jordan Lee is back in the side next week as he is direct and has the pace to get behind the opposition. Dowling would improve the side as well then we need a centre forward.
McGinty Young Davis Doran and Higgins did well today. The side is improving.

Just listened to GO's after match comments. I hope that I'm wrong but he doesn't sound as if he knows how to stop the rot.

[quote=knightmaregull post_id=214491 time=1507996230 user_id=22879]


Sadly I think rock bottom is still very much ahead of us
[/quote]

I think your spot on there

[quote=MellowYellow post_id=214497 time=1507997103 user_id=22826]
OFFICAL!

HISTORY MADE!

TRURO WIN!

Into the FA Cup First Round Proper,

Sorry Truro - no local derby - We are out - again!
[/quote]

They'll could still get Plymouth or Exeter...

[quote=Neal post_id=214498 time=1507997241 user_id=342]
And good luck to them. A club on the up with limited resources, well done!
[/quote]

Agreed, any team with limited resources but have a winning mentality and a love for the game deserve everything they get.