Torquay United Fans Forum

[quote=Bigman post_id=214020 time=1506940634 user_id=3743] [i][b]My suggestion would be that if points are dropped in the last 10 minutes, the squad have to go on a 10k run on Sunday morning. If the problem is fitness, this'll get them fitter; if it's mental this should make them focus - 10 minutes of effort now means a lie in tomorrow.[/b][/i][/quote]

With respect, I don't think that's a very intelligent solution. I think it's more a question of instilling concentration and game management for a full ninety minutes and that increased physical fitness will reduce errors partly caused by a tired mentality brought about by too much giving of possession away through careless distribution and thoughtless hoofing.

I must say I thought this latter aspect was much improved upon this Saturday and long distance runs the day after a match and long journey home are not conducive to recovery and the preparation for a game on Tuesday ~ more like retribution to me and that will get no-one anywhere!

I've been thinking of posting something on this for a while, it's become a running joke with my wife that she now asks whether we conceded in the 92nd or 93rd minute this week.

I started working out how many points we dropped last season from goals in the last 10 minutes, but having hardly ever been ahead or even level at that stage I got to Christmas and it wasn't actually that many, but over the years and particularly this season it's been a recurring theme.

Is it mental or down to fitness levels? And does anybody with any connection to the club know if anything's ever been done towards trying to address this? My suggestion would be that if points are dropped in the last 10 minutes, the squad have to go on a 10k run on Sunday morning. If the problem is fitness, this'll get them fitter; if it's mental this should make them focus - 10 minutes of effort now means a lie in tomorrow.

[quote=tufcyellowarmy post_id=213359 time=1505582640 user_id=19400]

Add another one to the tally.
My guess is that we will be head and shoulders above average for conceeding in the last minute .
Closing games out is as much about mental stamina as physical and we just dont have it.
Another kick in the chops ..........
[/quote]

And another one !!!!! >:( .

GO spell under Sheridan should provide him with useful knowledge regarding Luke Young and how best to utilise him. My feeling is that he is never going to be a box to box midfielder, he is not mobile enough. I don't think he's strong enough or disciplined enough to just sit back and be a holding Midfielder. IMO his best position would be in an advanced free role. However playing a 4-3-3 is causing us no end of problems utilising his and the other players.

Probably not a lot more in it than we havn't actually managed to win a game as yet. That's three now Guiseley, Chester and Barrow. We could have quite easily have had six more points than we have now which would have made a massive amount of difference.

Barrow hadn't lost at home - we havn't won away. Unfortunately there was an air of inevitably - that's why Owers was saying that its vital to get that first win on the board.

Lets make no mistake its the failure to win from winning positions that is hurting us at the moment bigtime.

[quote=forevertufc post_id=213384 time=1505636256 user_id=65]
[i][b]Don't ask Young to come deep, break up play, hate to use this phrase but ' quarter back ' the midfield, for instance, if you were playing diamond, you'd want Young at the head of it, further up the field, he's the one player we've got who can, and will open up the opposition door, showed that yesterday with Gray's goals as I understood from the commentary. To be fair, I wonder how much impact the loss of Dowling had yesterday, because he strikes me as the player Merse is talking about.[/b][/i][/quote]

Yes; I said in the week that I'd play Dowling there and some couldn't see it but if Young has to fulfil that role within the manager's selection then that is how it has been.

I don't think someone playing in that position is all about breaking up play though; I personally think they should be the best and most reliable passer of the ball in the team too as losing possession from the areas in which they are 'pocketed' is disastrous. When setting up a team, getting all the individual components to play within their allocated 'pockets' is essential to shape and balance. With Young; my gripe is that he drops back there rather than being designated to play there.

I've been watching my own son being 'quarter backed' at his new club this season as opposed to playing the 'number ten' role in which he is more comfortable ~ different coaches see different things in players and have different systems and players to fit them in amongst ~ that's football.

Agree with the sentiment in the post by Merse. I said to some friends I stand with who don't post on the forums, coming into the last 10 minutes or so of the Chester match, you could see the team drop deeper, and deeper over the previous 15 minutes or so, and the last 5 or going to be nervy.

But, in my opinion, we're asking Luke Young to be a player he is not, and has never been. O'Kane was always successful, because he had a , Mansell or Hargreaves in there, under Ling an extra man in midfield, which simply allowed O'Kane the freedom to do, what he did best, and Luke Young is that same kind of player.

Does my nut in, when you have potential match winners in a team, and you see a manager try to take away from a particular players 'A' game, this one criticism, dare I bring it up, I had with the last manager and Williams.

Don't ask Young to come deep, break up play, hate to use this phrase but ' quarter back ' the midfield, for instance, if you were playing diamond, you'd want Young at the head of it, further up the field, he's the one player we've got who can, and will open up the opposition door, showed that yesterday with Gray's goals as I understood from the commentary.

To be fair, I wonder how much impact the loss of Dowling had yesterday, because he strikes me as the player Merse is talking about.

Merse is spot on with his analysis of Young. A hugely overrated player who has hardly any influence or control of games whatsoever. A couple of ' wonder' free kicks a season is not a big enough contribution in my opinion.

My observation drawn from a few (mainly away) games this season is that Luke Young's habit of retreating deeper and deeper as the game goes on allows the opposition to press forward and get their hands on the throats of the United team. It is almost inevitable in those circumstances and it has always been the same with him.

A midfield fulcrum and 'leader' is needed who has far more guts and assertiveness than Young; the most overrated player in the club. Sure he can pass 'Hollywood style' but he's not that good at the bits and pieces so necessary to keep a grip in midfield and in the pro' game this is vital and that's why he found himself out on his arse at Argyle.

This inevitably brings growing pressure on the defence who find they're trying to play with their own midfield under their feet and they in turn retreat to playing right under the goalkeeper's nose. It's a recipe for disaster and the number one priority for this manager is to teach them to close a game out and win it!

There is no leader talking, Young should be doing this from the centre of midfield and I am sure Owers will have something to say about it. I would also say not having a central striker that can hold the ball makes a lot of difference as well, this should be addressed a.s.a.p.

Agree with the post above, sides conceding lots of late are normally down to, in the main physical fitness, but also mental. However, they do come hand in hand, if you want players concentrating for 90 minutes, they have to be first, physically fit for 90 minutes, our team haven't been, for long, long time.

[quote=StockyGull post_id=212067 time=1504666547 user_id=24193]

My guess is that when analysis is done Torquay might be only slightly above average in number of goals conceeded in last minute. My Dad thinks we do it every week but then he forgets when we do it. Don't mind doing analysis myself but not really sure where to get the data.
[/quote]
Add another one to the tally.
My guess is that we will be head and shoulders above average for conceeding in the last minute .
Closing games out is as much about mental stamina as physical and we just dont have it.
Another kick in the chops ..........

Send a PM to Gulliball. He has lots of stats.

So been lurking for a number of years but have finnaly decided to post something! Not sure I will become a regular poster but will see

We might have conceeded more goals than average over the years in the last minute. However someone will have to do some proper analysis to figure that out.

Simple psychology does mean we remember bad events over good events and hence nearly all football fans in the land (except maybe top 5 or 6 premiership clubs) will think there club conceeds loads of last minute goals. There is also the fact that clubs that are near the bottom of the table conceed more last minute goals then clubs near the top of the table (for obvious reasons). With Torquay being nearer the bottom then the top most seasons this might explain things as well.

My guess is that when analysis is done Torquay might be only slightly above average in number of goals conceeded in last minute. My Dad thinks we do it every week but then he forgets when we do it. Don't mind doing analysis myself but not really sure where to get the data.

On the balance it probably does feel like we have conceded more than score at the death over the years. But last season against southport and Solihull away where invaluable to our survival. Let's not forget paul Dobson against Crewe. I think if we had gone down that year, we probably wouldn't have a club know.