Torquay United Fans Forum

[quote="MH91"]It is a ridiculous thread..Manse is a great captain and is doing everything that a captain is supposed to do..arguing with the referee is not one of them...end of story..[/quote]

I've never seen him in a nice hat though!

It is a ridiculous thread..Manse is a great captain and is doing everything that a captain is supposed to do..arguing with the referee is not one of them...end of story..

The captain is the one who calls heads or tails and chooses to shoot towards the Babbacombe end.

Either that, or he's the one with the nice hat eating fish fingers.

I think this thread was about whether Manse is doing his job as the match-day captain rather than the rights or wrongs of questioning refereeing decisions.

In my mind the captain's role is not to harangue the referee but to try to ensure that the team follows the instructions given by management on the pitch and motivate and encourage individual players.

In this I think Manse has done a good job - its not his fault that the instructions earlier in the season led to drab football and poor results and what happened after Ling went sick could hardly be laid at his door. Certainly Knill seems to have a good relationship with him and seems to trust him as captain since he took over.

On another matter, I often thought Ling's decision to have two captains - Saah and Mansell - was bizarre and I've certainly seen no reason to support the view that Saah would be a better match-day captain.

[quote="Gullscorer"] The referee is God, even when he's wrong, and he, along with his assistants, and nobody else, must make the judgements to apply the laws of the game.[/quote]


:nod: It's great being God. :lol:

In short- the one with the armband.

I think asking Refs to book opponents can be counter productive. Particularly for a player like Manse who makes as many tackles as he does in a match. If a player has been telling the ref how to do his job all match there's every chance the official will be just itching for the annoying little creep to mistime a tackle himself so that he can be booked.

Gullscorer [quote]I remember John McEnroe's 'you cannot be serious' arguments with tennis umpires. Didn't do him or his reputation any good, didn't change umpires' minds, and did nothing for the game of tennis and its rules. [/quote]

I think Gullscorer is right in that it never gets a change of decision from the officials at the time, but it can effect the rules when viewed over the longer term. Frank Lampard and the England players could complain that the ball went two feet into the goal versus Germany in England's 2010 World Cup Finals match, but the officials still stubbornly insisted 'no goal'. However it was surely the catalyst for the goal line technology that we will see being introduced in the near future.

Similarly without McEnroe I don't think top level tennis would have pushed ahead anywhere near as quickly with developments like Hawkeye, and changes to the rules such as allowing players 3 challenges per set can probably be traced back to McEnroe questioning the accuracy of a good number of the calls.

[url]http://www.theaustralian.com.au/sport/hawk-eye-exposes-wimbledons-human-line-judges/story-e6frg7mf-1226415608799[/url]

As the above link shows, the introduction of hawkeye reveals that line judges get 3 out of 10 close calls at Wimbledon wrong. But as Gullscorer says, pointing out their mistakes didn't help McEnroe at the time.

John McEnroe was unavailable for comment yesterday, but he has previously said that Hawk-Eye would have prevented his tantrums. "I would have won a lot more majors," he said. "Forty per cent of the energy I wasted in losing [my temper] would have allowed me to focus on playing."

I'm sure he played a big part in making the tennis authorities invest in a system that would provide the more accurate decisions that tennis players enjoy today.

[quote="Gullscorer"]I remember John McEnroe's 'you cannot be serious' arguments with tennis umpires. Didn't do him or his reputation any good, didn't change umpires' minds, and did nothing for the game of tennis and its rules.[color=#FF0000] Same goes for challenging decisions or trying to influence officials in any sport. Focus on playing the game, and don't try to tell officials how to do their job.[/quote][/color]

Someone should tell Fergie, he's been doing it for decades and it hasn't done him any harm. :whistle:

You're right though, leave the harangueing to the fans and the players can concentrate on the game. Whoever is captain, he is there to organise and motivate the team and not to berate and attempt to the influence the officials into giving a decision that may never be given or changing a decision that will NEVER be changed.

Made for some good comedy...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fd90m3xKfl8

I remember John McEnroe's 'you cannot be serious' arguments with tennis umpires. Didn't do him or his reputation any good, didn't change umpires' minds, and did nothing for the game of tennis and its rules. Same goes for challenging decisions or trying to influence officials in any sport. Focus on playing the game, and don't try to tell officials how to do their job.

Anyone who was at the Chesterfield game would have seen Lee Mansell approach the referee at half time and full time, he also made several protests to the ref during that game.

Agreed though it is not the captain's job to spend all match having a go at the ref, and yesterday what did the ref do that was so wrong against Torquay. The ref yesterday gave several free kicks against Torquay and to be fair against York that should never have been so atleast he was consistant.

The penalty and red card, not seen it back on t.v however at the match said to my friend thats a penalty and he agreed, so I made the ref right on that.

[quote="Gullscorer"]Trying to influence the referee in your team's favour should, in my opinion, be regarded as unsportsmanlike behaviour. As should arguing with the referee.

As captain, it's your job to captain your team, not to boss the referee regarding decisions he has made, or might make during the game. Concentrate on playing the game, and let the referee make the decisions.

The referee is God, even when he's wrong, and he, along with his assistants, and nobody else, must make the judgements to apply the laws of the game.[/quote]
Quite right! Fatty Evans needs a lesson on this!

Trying to influence the referee in your team's favour should, in my opinion, be regarded as unsportsmanlike behaviour. As should arguing with the referee.

As captain, it's your job to captain your team, not to boss the referee regarding decisions he has made, or might make during the game. Concentrate on playing the game, and let the referee make the decisions.

A captain might, on occasion, ask the referee to consult the assistant, but that's about as far as it should go. The referee is God, even when he's wrong, and he, along with his assistants, and nobody else, must make the judgements to apply the laws of the game.

There is so much wrong with this, I'm not sure where to start. It's Sunday, I'll let someone else deal with it.

Matt.

I don't see what approaching the referee gains to be honest.

Once a ref has made up his mind to book a player, he is going to do it....I'm sure if the captain went up and spoke to him the ref would just tell him to go away.

How many times, once a ref has been approached, have they changed their mind? I can't think of any!!